Interface, your opinion.

Discussion about hacker.org's server
WhiteKnight
Posts: 276
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:21 am

Post by WhiteKnight »

canine wrote:
WhiteKnight wrote:
canine wrote:I think that this is reinventing the wheel in alot of ways.

You can do most or all of those things using other tools, other tools which are already implemented and thoroughly tested.
Yep that is completely correct. :)

I am trying to put all of these tools into one by reinventing the wheel. The main feature of that software is portability.

Sometime it gives more information than other tools for an example: Database.

All in all.... yep it is completely reinventing the wheel.
Well, reinventing the wheel, in most circumstances, at least, is not particularly good. What I'd suggest, is that you take existing tools and combine them into one.

So, you can write code to access a database. And you test it thoroughly and when all is said and done, there's still another program or library that does what you just did, but better. You've wasted a bunch of time when you could've just incorporated that code into your project.

So, rewrite when you have no access to source or there is no existing program, and just reuse where there is.
The real problem that caused me to do reinventing the wheel is that the program are usually have it own price and I cannot afford anything and of course they have their copyright and trademarks.

You may oppose to this method, but that method actually help me develop several techniques for programming practices. :)
canine
Posts: 190
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:38 am

Post by canine »

WhiteKnight wrote: The real problem that caused me to do reinventing the wheel is that the program are usually have it own price and I cannot afford anything and of course they have their copyright and trademarks.

You may oppose to this method, but that method actually help me develop several techniques for programming practices. :)
If you have to pay for a program*, there's a decent chance it's shitty.

*and don't receive the sauce along with it
WhiteKnight
Posts: 276
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:21 am

Post by WhiteKnight »

canine wrote:
WhiteKnight wrote: The real problem that caused me to do reinventing the wheel is that the program are usually have it own price and I cannot afford anything and of course they have their copyright and trademarks.

You may oppose to this method, but that method actually help me develop several techniques for programming practices. :)
If you have to pay for a program*, there's a decent chance it's shitty.

*and don't receive the sauce along with it
Don't worry about reinventing the wheel, because it almost done anyway. :)
canine
Posts: 190
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:38 am

Post by canine »

WhiteKnight wrote:Don't worry about reinventing the wheel, because it almost done anyway. :)
Well, that's the thing.

With coding, you're never done.

Say you reinvent the wheel with some library. There was a library to do graphics operations but you write your own.

The existing one is probably more efficient and contains less bugs. You'd need months and lots of programmers to get rid of the bugs.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but I just mean to provide another point of view.
WhiteKnight
Posts: 276
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:21 am

Post by WhiteKnight »

canine wrote:
WhiteKnight wrote:Don't worry about reinventing the wheel, because it almost done anyway. :)
Well, that's the thing.

With coding, you're never done.

Say you reinvent the wheel with some library. There was a library to do graphics operations but you write your own.

The existing one is probably more efficient and contains less bugs. You'd need months and lots of programmers to get rid of the bugs.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but I just mean to provide another point of view.
Well I spent a lot of time checking for the possibility for such bugs and it is extremely rare to none. And I was doing a development model of Prototyping Model. ->

This is a cyclic version of the linear model. In this model, once the requirement analysis is done and the design for a prototype is made, the development process gets started. Once the prototype is created, it is given to the customer for evaluation. The customer tests the package and gives his/her feed back to the developer who refines the product according to the customer's exact expectation. After a finite number of iterations, the final software package is given to the customer. In this methodology, the software is evolved as a result of periodic shuttling of information between the customer and developer. This is the most popular development model in the contemporary IT industry. Most of the successful software products have been developed using this model - as it is very difficult (even for a whiz kid!) to comprehend all the requirements of a customer in one shot. There are many variations of this model skewed with respect to the project management styles of the companies. New versions of a software product evolve as a result of prototyping.

And yes I know you're trying to suggest me to do Rapid Application Development (RAD) Model.

The RAD model is a linear sequential software development process that emphasizes an extremely short development cycle. The RAD model is a "high speed" adaptation of the linear sequential model in which rapid development is achieved by using a component-based construction approach. Used primarily for information systems applications, the RAD approach encompasses the following phases:

1. Business modeling

The information flow among business functions is modeled in a way that answers the following questions:

What information drives the business process?
What information is generated?
Who generates it?
Where does the information go?
Who processes it?

2. Data modeling

The information flow defined as part of the business modeling phase is refined into a set of data objects that are needed to support the business. The characteristic (called attributes) of each object is identified and the relationships between these objects are defined.

3. Process modeling

The data objects defined in the data-modeling phase are transformed to achieve the information flow necessary to implement a business function. Processing the descriptions are created for adding, modifying, deleting, or retrieving a data object.

4. Application generation

The RAD model assumes the use of the RAD tools like VB, VC++, Delphi etc... rather than creating software using conventional third generation programming languages. The RAD model works to reuse existing program components (when possible) or create reusable components (when necessary). In all cases, automated tools are used to facilitate construction of the software.

5. Testing and turnover

Since the RAD process emphasizes reuse, many of the program components have already been tested. This minimizes the testing and development time.

But there are some concerns that even Open Sources wouldn't let me sell their components that is included in my project for sell.
canine
Posts: 190
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:38 am

Post by canine »

WhiteKnight wrote: Well I spent a lot of time checking for the possibility for such bugs and it is extremely rare to none. And I was doing a development model of Prototyping Model. ->

This is a cyclic version of the linear model. In this model, once the requirement analysis is done and the design for a prototype is made, the development process gets started. Once the prototype is created, it is given to the customer for evaluation. The customer tests the package and gives his/her feed back to the developer who refines the product according to the customer's exact expectation. After a finite number of iterations, the final software package is given to the customer. In this methodology, the software is evolved as a result of periodic shuttling of information between the customer and developer. This is the most popular development model in the contemporary IT industry. Most of the successful software products have been developed using this model - as it is very difficult (even for a whiz kid!) to comprehend all the requirements of a customer in one shot. There are many variations of this model skewed with respect to the project management styles of the companies. New versions of a software product evolve as a result of prototyping.

And yes I know you're trying to suggest me to do Rapid Application Development (RAD) Model.

The RAD model is a linear sequential software development process that emphasizes an extremely short development cycle. The RAD model is a "high speed" adaptation of the linear sequential model in which rapid development is achieved by using a component-based construction approach. Used primarily for information systems applications, the RAD approach encompasses the following phases:

1. Business modeling

The information flow among business functions is modeled in a way that answers the following questions:

What information drives the business process?
What information is generated?
Who generates it?
Where does the information go?
Who processes it?

2. Data modeling

The information flow defined as part of the business modeling phase is refined into a set of data objects that are needed to support the business. The characteristic (called attributes) of each object is identified and the relationships between these objects are defined.

3. Process modeling

The data objects defined in the data-modeling phase are transformed to achieve the information flow necessary to implement a business function. Processing the descriptions are created for adding, modifying, deleting, or retrieving a data object.

4. Application generation

The RAD model assumes the use of the RAD tools like VB, VC++, Delphi etc... rather than creating software using conventional third generation programming languages. The RAD model works to reuse existing program components (when possible) or create reusable components (when necessary). In all cases, automated tools are used to facilitate construction of the software.

5. Testing and turnover

Since the RAD process emphasizes reuse, many of the program components have already been tested. This minimizes the testing and development time.

But there are some concerns that even Open Sources wouldn't let me sell their components that is included in my project for sell.
Well, I find most of the various `software development methodologies' to be meaningless marketdroid gibberish. I don't subscribe to any of them, really.

With that being said, you should always reuse as much as possible. And reuse doesn't imply use of crap like VB. There are infinitely more and better libraries available for C than for shitty languages like VB.

And free software/open source almost always insists on the right to sell your product.

I can slap some GNU utilities on a CD and I am legally entitled to sell it, should I choose to do so.
WhiteKnight
Posts: 276
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:21 am

Post by WhiteKnight »

Aye, but there are some "false" gnu license that wouldn't let me sell with it.
canine
Posts: 190
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:38 am

Post by canine »

WhiteKnight wrote:Aye, but there are some "false" gnu license that wouldn't let me sell with it.
That's likely illegal.

If a license says that it is `gnu' and denies you the right to sell your work, or hell, if it isn't truly a gnu license, it's most likely illegal.
WhiteKnight
Posts: 276
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:21 am

Post by WhiteKnight »

canine wrote:
WhiteKnight wrote:Aye, but there are some "false" gnu license that wouldn't let me sell with it.
That's likely illegal.

If a license says that it is `gnu' and denies you the right to sell your work, or hell, if it isn't truly a gnu license, it's most likely illegal.
That is commonly what I was dealing with. And most of the time I was concerned about a component either it could be malicious or corrupt.

I got 6 different kinds of key loggers on my computer and I have to eliminate each one of them. They are all from an Open Source products that I find online. So it is more than good enough reason not to do components base software development.
canine
Posts: 190
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:38 am

Post by canine »

WhiteKnight wrote: That is commonly what I was dealing with. And most of the time I was concerned about a component either it could be malicious or corrupt.

I got 6 different kinds of key loggers on my computer and I have to eliminate each one of them. They are all from an Open Source products that I find online. So it is more than good enough reason not to do components base software development.
I am skeptical. Link?
WhiteKnight
Posts: 276
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:21 am

Post by WhiteKnight »

canine wrote:
WhiteKnight wrote: That is commonly what I was dealing with. And most of the time I was concerned about a component either it could be malicious or corrupt.

I got 6 different kinds of key loggers on my computer and I have to eliminate each one of them. They are all from an Open Source products that I find online. So it is more than good enough reason not to do components base software development.
I am skeptical. Link?
It was about 2 years ago and I was of course strict but staying away from open source components.

The thing is that the open source can add an adverse effect on user computer whoever buy a product that include with that open source code.

I cannot provide a link yet, because it is about 2 years old and still looking for that malicious open source.
canine
Posts: 190
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:38 am

Post by canine »

WhiteKnight wrote:
canine wrote:
WhiteKnight wrote: That is commonly what I was dealing with. And most of the time I was concerned about a component either it could be malicious or corrupt.

I got 6 different kinds of key loggers on my computer and I have to eliminate each one of them. They are all from an Open Source products that I find online. So it is more than good enough reason not to do components base software development.
I am skeptical. Link?
It was about 2 years ago and I was of course strict but staying away from open source components.

The thing is that the open source can add an adverse effect on user computer whoever buy a product that include with that open source code.

I cannot provide a link yet, because it is about 2 years old and still looking for that malicious open source.
There is no malicious free software.

If something is malicious and free, no one would use it.
Post Reply